“Some of Tate’s content is actually ‘Have a strong mindset,work hard,make a career,back yourself’. And then there is this whole other side to his content,which is very traditional outdated belief systems around treatment of women,that’s the really kind of messy toxic stuff to be worried about.”
Tate appeals because he has all the things young men are told represent success,Johnson says:“Being ripped,smoking cigars,wearing tailored suits,nice sunglasses,around beautiful women,on jetski boats. Young men have adopted the language. It’s called Tate-isms,certain language like ‘you’re a top G’,which means you’re like a legend or an alpha ... a bit of a top dog.”
Many schools are struggling to deal with it.
As one female teacher told Man Cave:“I found it difficult to talk to the boys about Tate,they saw me as a ‘crazy feminist’. I leant on my male staff to talk to the boys.” In the end,though,“we ended up outlawing Andrew Tate talk altogether”.
But Johnson believes it is critical that discussions about Tate are held in schools. The challenge for parents and educators,he says,is to give boys the opportunity to express their perspectives without being shamed,and then to explore with them how some of his views are harmful.
“The way to do that is to create teachable moments where they can have politically incorrect,messy conversations.”
“When he talks about women are his property and they bear some responsibility for being raped – just as a blank sentence like that,it’s very vile,” Dan says. “But when you listen to him explain it,it’s not like he’s right,but you can see the perspective that he is coming from.”
Dan is sceptical about Tate and his brother’sarrest in Romania on December 29. The brothers have been detained for 30 days. After news of his arrest,a tweet on Tate’s Twitter account said “The Matrix sent their agents”. Tate often uses “the Matrix” to describe mainstream society as opposed to his “real world”. It is a reference to the 1999 filmThe Matrix,where the protagonist is invited to take a red pill and reveal the world as it really is.
“Obviously,I don’t know the truth about what is happening,” Dan says. But he reckons Tate knew the arrest was coming. “He said multiple times:‘you get three strikes – the first they try to cancel you,the second they’ll put you in jail,the third,they’ll try to kill you’.
“I think they will do whatever they can to shut him up.”
Shifting blame to women
WhenThe Age and theHerald canvassed young people last week,views on Tate ranged from disgust and horror to a belief that he makes some salient points about masculinity. All the young women we spoke to condemned him,but the men were divided.
Chloe,an 18-year-old university student,said his worst utterance was at the height of the #MeToo movement in 2017 when hetweeted that if women put themselves in a position to be raped,they “must bear some responsibility”.
“He’s shifting the blame on women,again,for being victims of violence and that’s just really harmful,especially if young boys are listening to that.”
But Josh,24,believes Tate is often taken out of context and labelled as misogynistic because hour-long interviews are clipped into short soundbites. Sometimes,Josh says,he is joking when he makes sexist comments about women.
Josh,who first discovered Tate after listening to him featured on an episode of US comedian Tom Segura’s podcast,is attracted to his messages about motivation and hard work.
“Like you know,as hard as it’s going to be you can’t ever back down. You have to always work hard on yourself. If you want to be active,you have to go to the gym and … eat well,and so on.”
Asked why he thought Tate was popular among young men,Josh says:“It’s all about the masculinity isn’t it,really? It seems that there’s a bit of an agenda getting pushed everywhere in the world.
“It’s just a refreshing voice of somebody who’s saying what everyone is deep-down thinking.”
Vinnie,17,profoundly disagrees with Tate’s views on women and was “pretty happy” to hear he had been arrested.
He discovered Tate months ago and understood the appeal of some of his motivational videos,but never liked Tate’s “superficial” persona and grew more opposed after learning of his misogyny.
He is also concerned that new internet personalities are expressing increasingly shocking views to attract eyeballs.
“There’s always been figures like that,who young,impressionable people are drawn to,but I feel like it has slowly been getting more extreme the last few years,especially after coronavirus.”
Life in the manosphere
Tate is the latest in a succession of manosphere influencers. Others include Canadian psychologist Jordan Peterson,who says “the masculine spirit is under assault”,and bloggerDaryush Valizadeh,better known as Roosh V,who in 2019 renounced many of his “neo-masculinist” views and declared himself a devout Christian.
Deakin University political sociologist Associate Professor Josh Roose says the manosphere reflects the views of men who believe they are disenfranchised and the world no longer holds the possibilities for them that it once did. Many of them believe feminism’s critique of men’s behaviour has damaged relationships between the sexes.
“So there is a sense amongst a swathe of men out there that people like Andrew Tate might be a solution by buying into that neo-masculinity,or you could call it effectively a violent misogynist masculinity,that men must reclaim their places as head of society,as head of the household and that women must fall into line,” Roose says.
“That ties into a much broader issue of what’s happening with men globally,particularly amongst younger men in the West,where there’s been a backlash against feminism,against #MeToo.”
‘All my students in Year 11 knew who Tate was. Female students ... had absolute looks of disgust ... male students wanted to begin a debate.’
Secondary school commerce teacher Casey Megna
Roose is examining the impact of manosphere influencers such as Tate on the online harassment and abuse of women – and whether this flows into real world violence – as part of his research into anti-women online movements. He says schools need to educate parents about the dangers posed by misogynistic views about women.
“If the far right were infiltrating our schools,or if Salafi jihadists were infiltrating our Muslim community schools with these sorts of narratives,there would be a lot more outrage and a much harder crackdown.”
Bettina,a year 12 student and youth activist from girls’ charity Plan International Australia,is concerned that boys are internalising Tate’s misogynistic messages because his views are so prevalent on social media that they have become accepted regardless of whether they are factual.
She is also worried that “freedom of speech” is often championed as a reason as to why he should be allowed to say whatever he wants. “When you become someone with millions of followers,you become a role model,” Bettina says.
Casey Megna,who teaches at a co-ed Melbourne secondary school,says Tate had “become a bit like an idol” for some boys at her school.
“I’ve even had students that I’ve never met before asking me my opinion on Tate during yard duty or whether I was going to bet on the Tate vs[Jake] Paul boxing match.”
Megna,who teaches commerce,says Tate’s businesses and influence was brought up during a Year 11 ethics discussion about how Adidas hadended its partnership with rapper Kanye West over his anti-Semitic comments.
“All my students within the Year 11 class knew who Tate was. My female students ... had absolute looks of disgust over their faces at the mention of his name;my male students wanted to begin a debate about him and were very familiar with his ‘philosophy’.
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“We talked about the TikTok algorithms,and the fact that a lot of the stuff that is being picked up is very misogynistic,and that those views are actually quite poisonous and dangerous.”
Megna,who is 28 and a gamer,feels fortunate that she is connected to the online world and is able to engage her students in discussion.
“Tate is a dangerous person who has a significant amount of influence on young males,but I believe he is one of many,such as Logan Paul[Jake Paul’s brother] and Adin Ross,who have a large reach and power through social media,especially TikTok,” she says.
“I find myself having to keep my finger on the pulse so I can almost be a buffer of some sort to explain that those views are extreme.”
Megna can understand why some teachers,who may not be familiar with Tate’s cultural references,may struggle to make him a teachable moment.
“I feel like Andrew Tate is a perfect example of the need to look at the way that we teach curriculum,and how we teach kids about engaging on social media and the sort of things that can happen.”
*The Age and theHerald have elected not to publish the surnames of the young people quoted in this article,as a number are under 18.
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